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 ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***

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SylvesterMalone1978
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PostSubject: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:14 pm

First topic message reminder :

Ding dong the which is dead! Hope is restored and Hunt is the opposite of cheap!
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:32 pm

There are a few QBs that will be there in 2 that have just as much potential. If we stay at #1 I think the pick is Joeckel. Why pay Albert franchise type money when you can get a guy a lot better for much less?
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:33 pm

Joekel isn't a top tier LT. He is to LT, what Smith is to QB. QB is more important, and Albert is an above average LT just like Joekel might be.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:36 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
Joekel isn't a top tier LT. He is to LT, what Smith is to QB. QB is more important, and Albert is an above average LT just like Joekel might be.

QB is more important yes except that there isnt any worth the #1 pick in this draft. There isnt one worth top 15 pick. and Joekel is much better than Albert.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:41 pm

LT Luke Joeckel TEXAS A&M



- Joeckel is truly a dynamite LT prospect playing in the age of the quarterback; therefore his ability to keep him protected with enough time to read defenses is highly valued. He has the measurables you look for at 6’6 310 lb and the athleticism to mirror defenders on the edge.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:43 pm

Warmack is a far more superior OL than Joekel. OG is also a bigger need than LT. We have a good young OL as long as we bring Albert back. You can ask Charles what he thinks of Albert, because he wouldn't get half of those yards without him. Albert might look worse than he is because Cassel makes all OL's look bad, but even he doesn't make Albert look bad. Most teams would love a LT of Alberts caliber.. we don't need to draft a LT. Joekel is no Roaf or Pace, hell hes not even Thomas or Long.. or anything close.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:44 pm

1) Luke Joeckel OT/Texas A&M- This is the safe pick in the draft. Joeckel has great size at 6’6, 310 pounds, but it’s his athleticism that allows him to be a dominant left tackle. The team that selects him could feel confident about the left tackle spot for the next 10-15 years.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:45 pm

4. Philadelphia Eagles: Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M (Jr.) (SCOUTING REPORT)

If Texas A&M offensive tackle Luke Joeckel is available when the Philadelphia Eagles are on the clock, they will be hard-pressed to pass him up. Joeckel is an outstanding all-around left tackle prospect who could be the building block of their offensive line for many years to come.

The Eagles’ offensive line has struggled mightily this season, and even if All-Pro left tackle Jason Peters returns healthy and strong next season from a torn Achilles, drafting the best offensive lineman in the draft class would be a great investment.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:47 pm

thleticism
+Joeckel has uncanny athletic ability, he makes movements look effortless that most other OT’s looked labored doing
+Has the ability to mirror speed rushers off the edge and force them beyond the pocket and out of the play
+Stays Light on his feet and is able to slide quickly to stay out in front
+Doesn’t rely solely on ability to stay in front of defenders to block pass rusher, Utilizes both his athleticism, long frame, and technical ability to block effectively
+Does a great job getting out of his stance, and moves really well in the open field
+Works well out of the tandem block to get to the 2nd level and get his hands on the LB thanks to speed
-Can get caught by elite level DE’s, Sam Motgomery was able to give Joeckel some trouble because he can combine power with speed and it had Joeckel guessing
-Joeckel got flat footed and Montgomery who was able to generate some push into the pocket off his bull rush, Joeckel was able to re-anchor and stop the rush but it could expose a slight issue

Intelligence
+Went from blocking for Jerrod Johnson, to Ryan Tannehill, to finally Johnny Manziel in his career with the Aggies, all those QB’s had active feet and required Joeckel to be aware of the blocking call and assignments
+Played in a predominant spread based system utilizing a man blocking scheme
+While there wasn’t a ton of experience in either a zone or area scheme he does show the natural ability to operate in it
+Has a high level of awareness, does a good job seeing the blitz as it comes and is able to pick up stunting or twisting DL as they try and confuse the offensive line

Run Blocking
+Plays with great leverage, does a good job staying low and standing the defender up out of his stance
+Has good drive blocking technique with his hand placement and footwork
+Really utilizes his long arms to extend out and control the defender
+Works with Jake Matthews along the goal line to run a jumbo package where Matthews aligns to his outside shoulder and both work to clear out an entire side of the defensive line
+Has a leg drive that allows him to generate great push off contact
+Walls off defenders to create lanes that the RB can find and explode through
+May be the best 2nd level blocker in the country
+Gets out in front of sweeps and screen passes to lead block on the outside, uses his size to engulf smaller DB’s on the perimeter
-When Joeckel lets his footwork get away from himself, he will reach and lose his technique
-He’ll bend at the waist and get himself over extended, this tends to occur the most when trying to get to a 2nd level block

Pass Protection
+Joeckel is the definition of a premier pass defender, there is no question as to his elite status as a LT prospect
+Has nice long arms that he uses well in pass protection to extend and keep the defender off of him
+Strong hands allow him to maintain control of the block and prevent the defender from shedding and making a play
+Almost always balanced and in perfect position for his block, he’s very tough to rock out of his stance
+Slides well with the speed rushers, and anchors well v. power rushers, got lots of practice going one on one with #1 2014 DE Damontre Moore
+His ability to combine length, athleticism, and technique together make him among the toughest OT’s to beat, he has the ability to not only shut down initial moves but also the counter moves that many of the best pass rushers utilize
+Also because of Joeckel’s intelligence he’s very difficult to set up and get him to take false steps, he doesn’t often cheat or guess rather having confidence in his ability to beat you no matter what you do
-Don’t see the heavy handed punch as one would assume he has due to his strength
-Relies far more on his feet than his hands at this point his career, if he can add a neutralizing punch he could become an elite level blocker

Technique
+Prototype OT, you want every aspiring OT from youth football to the college ranks to watch his film and mimic his ability
+Combination of abilities (Size, Speed, Skill) is simply uncanny, you don’t often see a prospect who is this well put together
+Not really any true consistent flaw in his game, he has his hiccups like any other OT will but it’s very hard to find a consistent low light and point to it and say he needs to do this better.
-Will need to polish up some finer points and get away from the occasional flat footed tendency but otherwise he’s a Day 1 ready starter

Overview:
Joeckel is the #1 OT in this class, despite some people preferring Lewan or even Matthews to him. He’s a guy you know that you can put into your LT spot and not have to even worry about it for the next 10-15 years. I truly believe he’s one of these once every 5-10 draft type prospects and we haven’t seen one sine Jake Long came out of Michigan.

Joeckel doesn’t struggle in any aspect of the game and is just as good a run blocker as he is a pass protector. His skill set combination is nearly unheard of from a junior and when you consider his level of intelligence it’s scary to think about how good he is now as this point in his young career.

I expect Joeckel to go in the Top 5 picks of the 2013 Draft should he declare and he could easily be in the running for the #1 pick.

Scouting Notes

Joeckel v. Florida
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:52 pm

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure they say that about at least one LT a year. I think there was one year a few years back where they had three LT's like that, and none panned out like that(at least yet).
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:52 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
Warmack is a far more superior OL than Joekel. OG is also a bigger need than LT. We have a good young OL as long as we bring Albert back. You can ask Charles what he thinks of Albert, because he wouldn't get half of those yards without him. Albert might look worse than he is because Cassel makes all OL's look bad, but even he doesn't make Albert look bad. Most teams would love a LT of Alberts caliber.. we don't need to draft a LT. Joekel is no Roaf or Pace, hell hes not even Thomas or Long.. or anything close.

Ask Charles? You mean the guy that thinks Crennel is a good coach? If Charles had a better than average LT maybe he is chasing the record instead of AP.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:53 pm

If Charles had a passing game and a team with a lead, he would have the record with this OL as is.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:56 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure they say that about at least one LT a year. I think there was one year a few years back where they had three LT's like that, and none panned out like that(at least yet).

Hed be a much better pick than any QB in this class no question. Cousins would be the elite QB prospect in this class. Paying Albert top 5 LT money would be as dumb as giving Bowe Calvin Johnson money.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:58 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
If Charles had a passing game and a team with a lead, he would have the record with this OL as is.

and if Rogers had AP hed throw for 100 TDs a year. No if Charles had a passing game hed be used even less in the run game
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:00 pm

If Joekel is the pick I hope to see you posting on here what a stupid pick it is and how Joekel is a joke afterwards.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:02 pm

Chiefs09 wrote:
SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
If Charles had a passing game and a team with a lead, he would have the record with this OL as is.

and if Rogers had AP hed throw for 100 TDs a year. No if Charles had a passing game hed be used even less in the run game

Lol what? Being able to move the chains and stay on the field would give Charles just as many if not more carries. Not to mention take defenders out of the box for him to get more YPC. Every defense we faced knew he was our only weapon.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:08 pm

The Chiefs graded out to have the 7th best OL in the NFL this year. Thats even with injurys, and Cassel making it look worse than it is. I'm really starting to question how much you know about football if you don't think Albert is one of the better LT's.

Whos a tier two QB? Rothlisberger, Ryan, Rivers... thats like saying those teams should draft a new QB because they aren't THE best.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:08 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
If Charles had a passing game and a team with a lead, he would have the record with this OL as is.

and if Rogers had AP hed throw for 100 TDs a year. No if Charles had a passing game hed be used even less in the run game

Lol what? Being able to move the chains and stay on the field would give Charles just as many if not more carries. Not to mention take defenders out of the box for him to get more YPC. Every defense we faced knew he was our only weapon.

Every defense knew AP was the Vikings only weapon.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:11 pm

SylvesterMalone1978 wrote:
The Chiefs graded out to have the 7th best OL in the NFL this year. Thats even with injurys, and Cassel making it look worse than it is. I'm really starting to question how much you know about football if you don't think Albert is one of the better LT's.

Whos a tier two QB? Rothlisberger, Ryan, Rivers... thats like saying those teams should draft a new QB because they aren't THE best.
Rivers is a joke. he is a notch above Cassel these days. I'm saying why pay Albert top tier money when you can get a better guy for about a third the cost. that allows you to have more money for a pass happy HC to go out and maybe afford a Jennings and Wallace both.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:13 pm

again stick to your guns if Joekel is the pick and blast it. but I imagine itll be the same crap rust said after Poe was the pick. he hated it before hand but after the pick was made he looked deeper into it and it was perfect.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:17 pm

Funny, coming from the guy who threw a fit about the Chiefs not paying a #2 CB top tier money. Carr isn't an elite CB, but you wanted him paid like one even though he wasn't even our top CB. Now a premium position and a harder spot to fill, you don't want to pay him? Makes sense.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:48 pm

LOL. Carr is better than any secondary player we had this year. This coming from a guy that has authentic jerseys of both Flowers and Berry.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:09 pm

and why is it funny to want them to spend money on players that are worth it? guys like Hali, charles and Carr are all worth what they got. Bowe and Albert on the other hand are not worth elite money. Now if Albert is wanting middle of the road LT money then pay him but I doubt that is what he is asking for. Sort of like Bowe thinking he deserves Calvin money.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:35 pm

I think I would have to agree w/09. I say draft Joekel in the 1st and best QB in 2nd or move back up into 1stto take a QB. No QB is worth #1 overall. The closest would be Smith and his stats look good but he is not anywhere near worth 1st overall. Like 09 said take the LT and save $$$ by letting Alberts go. Besides why pay him big $$$ when he is already having back problems.
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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:52 pm

If its not Geno it has to be Jones or Moore. So draft Geno because no other position makes sense. Sure as hell don't need a LT if we resign Albert... But I get it, a lot of Chiefs fans have cried LT in the first round since the Vermiel era and we lost that HOF OL.

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PostSubject: Re: ***Official Pioli Fire, Reid Hired Thread***   Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:03 pm

Only way Joekel has a remote chance is if neither Albert or Bowe agrees to deals, and we tag Bowe.

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